Here's from Volume 1 which I recently purchased. Feedback is appreciated. Bolded ones I think are too high incident too low @TheLastSonofCzarnia said: Here's from Volume 1 which I recently purchased. Feedback is appreciated. Amazo - 19 Ambush Bug - 0 Aquaman - 10 Ares - 16 Atom Smasher - 15/5. He's a what 50 tonner normal size 70 tonner when 100ft tall Atomic Skull - 12 Atrocitus - 10 Big Barda - 15 Bizarro - 19 Black Adam - 19 Blackfire - 10 Blockbuster - 10 Blue Devil - 11 Booster Gold - 10 Brainiac - 13 Plasmus - 10 Captain Atom - 15 with the quantum field LIMITLESS strength Captain Comet - 11 - after resurrection OK but if before add 4 at least Captain Marvel - 19 Mary Marvel - 17 Why are the marvels not all equal- same power levels compleely???

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CM3 - 17 Chemo - 18 Colossal Boy - 14/2. Superwoman - 16 Didn't she just use mass altering and anti grav to simulate strength Ultraman - 19 The Barracuda - 10 The White Martian - 16 Cyborg Superman - 19 Darkseid - 18 He's as strong if not stronger than S'man Granny Goodness - 11 Kalibak - 14 The Demon - 10 My biggest entry to which I object, and also why I included 10 strength and less this time around Despero - 18 Doctor Fate - 10 Doomsday - 20 Elasti-Woman - 12/0. Negative Man - 9/1.

Since when did Larry Trainer have strength. Robotman - 10 Eclipso - 13 Eradicator - 19 Validus - 20 Mammoth - 14 The General - 18 General Zod - 18???

=/= S'man, therefore Eradiactor, CM and Marvel Family etc Ursa - 17 Non - 20 Geo-Force - 13 Giganta - 16/4. WTF Gorilla Grodd - 9 Hourman (Rick Tyler) - 9/3. he's a 2 to 3 tonner For F@#$ sake Jemm - 12 Blackbriar Thorn - 2/14.

Isis - 16 Osiris - 16 Citizen Steel - 16 Kestrel - 9 Killer Croc - 10 If Aquamna who's supported 12 story builings, punched wholes in armored war vessels is a 10 than KC is NOWHERE near one. @AlmightyDarkseid said: @Killemall said: @AlmightyDarkseid said: doomsday, cyborg superman ARE stronger than despero, isnt a mistake This simply cannot be true, Despero has fought entire league, one shotted superman level character before. He has to be up there with Darkseid in terms of physical strength, probably even stronger if we use the recent versions of Darkseid. So have general eiling, and doomsday I think you are missing the point here, Cyborg Superman is a superman level character in physical strength therefore Despero should be stronger than him. Doomsday would depend on the version, Death of Superman version of Doomsday who had problems trading blows with Maxima, albiet beat her is not going to be above Despero in physical strength while Doomsday War verison who one shotted Orion should be on the same ball park.

Dont know much about General Eiling, apart from that fact that his pic looks gangsta! So no comments there. @Killemall said: I think you are missing the point here, Cyborg Superman is a superman level character in physical strength therefore Despero should be stronger than him.

Doomsday would depend on the version, Death of Superman version of Doomsday who had problems trading blows with Maxima, albiet beat her is not going to be above Despero in physical strength Death of Superman Doomsday also tossed a frightened Darkseid out on his ear like a child, killed the Guardians' champion, and tore Master Mayhem limb from limb. Although Doomsday pulled these feats off, I have serious doubts that Despero would be three for three.

@Switchdoctor said: Death of Superman Doomsday also tossed a frightened Darkseid out on his ear like a child, killed the Guardians' champion, and tore Master Mayhem limb from limb. Although Doomsday pulled these feats off, I have serious doubts that Despero would be three for three. Never remember the first one happening, second one well Green Lantern is a green lantern without feats to prove otherwise he's still on same power level, so i dont know what you are referring to. Despero has fought and beaten the justice league all on his own before and has done so more than once.

He's fought Superman, Wonderwoman and Martian Manhunter together and won. I dont know what you are even asking. @Switchdoctor said: @Killemall said: I think you are missing the point here, Cyborg Superman is a superman level character in physical strength therefore Despero should be stronger than him. Doomsday would depend on the version, Death of Superman version of Doomsday who had problems trading blows with Maxima, albiet beat her is not going to be above Despero in physical strength Death of Superman Doomsday also tossed a frightened Darkseid out on his ear like a child, killed the Guardians' champion, and tore Master Mayhem limb from limb. Although Doomsday pulled these feats off, I have serious doubts that Despero would be three for three.

Doomsday owns despero, with ease. @AlmightyDarkseid said: who do u think is more powerful overall? And are they on the same league? First lets clarify, we are still talking about Death of Superman version, correct?

He was having problems with superman and then with Maxima, albiet beat both. Bio on countdown seem to say Doomsday died in Death of Superman.

Despero on the other hand was one shotting Martian Manhunter and Kara. He overall seemed stronger. This doesnt hold true once you start looking at evolved version of Doomsday past that point though, like Hunter/Prey who'd probably beat Despero. @Killemall said: @AlmightyDarkseid said: desperos main attack is his telepathy, doomsday could adapt to it, and beat him Yes and telepathy doesnt work on Doomsday anyways MM has tried. But that being said, apart from Telepathy Despero has more than enough strength to hold his own against Doomsday, specially the incarnation which we are talking about. Telepathy does work on Doomsday.

You just have to be a very powerful mentalist. Manchester Black, Brainiac, and Doctor Psycho have all been successful. @Switchdoctor said: Uh, no. Telepathy does work on Doomsday. You just have to be a very powerful mentalist.

Manchester Black, Brainiac, and Doctor Psycho have all been successful. Thats news to me. Braniac did not use TP on him he just took control of his body with science because he breed him from a child assuming you are talking about Doomsday Wars.

Manchester Black, frankly i do not even know who is he so this is not something i have read i would assume its true. Doctor Psycho isnt a better telepath than Martian Manhunter, and MM failed to TP Doomsday, so thats probably PIS.

Which issue did it take place, i have $2 that says it was written by Loeb:p. @Killemall said: @Switchdoctor said: Uh, no. Telepathy does work on Doomsday. You just have to be a very powerful mentalist. Manchester Black, Brainiac, and Doctor Psycho have all been successful. Thats news to me.

Braniac did not use TP on him he just took control of his body with science because he breed him from a child assuming you are talking about Doomsday Wars. I am talking about Doomsday Wars, and no, Brainiac was mind-controlling the original until he could engineer a mindless Doomsday clone body for himself. Superman had to drive Brainiac out of Doomsday's head by using a S.T.A.R. Labs psi blocker. Manchester Black, frankly i do not even know who is he so this is not something i have read i would assume its true.

Manchester Black is a better telepath than J'onn. He made Superman and Bizarro swap bodies with his telepathy, and prevented J'onn from knowing that he did it. Doctor Psycho isnt a better telepath than Martian Manhunter, and MM failed to TP Doomsday, so thats probably PIS. MM consistently loses to Doomsday. @Switchdoctor said: I am talking about Doomsday Wars, and no, Brainiac was mind-controlling the original until he could engineer a mindless Doomsday clone body for himself. Superman had to drive Brainiac out of Doomsday's head by using a S.T.A.R.

Labs psi blocker. Thats not how i remember it, he stopped Doomsday from dying and then transferred his consciousness into him, Manchester Black is a better telepath than J'onn. He made Superman and Bizarro swap bodies with his telepathy, and prevented J'onn from knowing that he did it. You still havent given me a issue number or scan of when Manchester Black TPed Doomsday, although thats impressive. MM consistently loses to Doomsday. Isnt that what i exactly said, MM loses to Doomsday but is a better telepath than Dr. Psyco and has mindraped Spectre twice, has touched the mind of everyone on earth etc.

So i still think Dr. Psyco controlling or TPing Doomsday is a PIS. @Killemall said: @Switchdoctor said: I am talking about Doomsday Wars, and no, Brainiac was mind-controlling the original until he could engineer a mindless Doomsday clone body for himself. Superman had to drive Brainiac out of Doomsday's head by using a S.T.A.R. Labs psi blocker.

Thats not how i remember it, he stopped Doomsday from dying and then transferred his consciousness into him, Yes, and then it was up to Brainiac to dominate him telepathically while using Doomsday as a temporary host body until he could engineer a mindless clone. You still havent given me a issue number or scan of when Manchester Black TPed Doomsday, although thats impressive. I don't know how it became my responsibility to tell you issue numbers, but it happened in. Google it even.

Black was the only one on the Suicide Squad who survived at the time by reprogramming Doomsday to tear into Imperiex probes. Isnt that what i exactly said, MM loses to Doomsday but is a better telepath than Dr.

Psyco and has mindraped Spectre twice, has touched the mind of everyone on earth etc. So i still think Dr. Psyco controlling or TPing Doomsday is a PIS. To claim that J'onn is able to flat out mindrape the Spectre comes off as gross exaggeration on your part.

Totally ridiculous. @Switchdoctor said: Yes, and then it was up to Brainiac to dominate him telepathically while using Doomsday as a temporary host body until he could engineer a mindless clone. Thats not TP, when you say TP its like being able to put down a character using telepathy, not the same thing. I don't know how it became my responsibility to tell you issue numbers, but it happened in.

Google it even. Black was the only one on the Suicide Squad who survived at the time by reprogramming Doomsday to tear into Imperiex probes. If you say something in the battle forum people expect you to back it by using scans or issue number. And being able to reprogram Doomsday isnt Telepathy. To claim that J'onn is able to flat out mindrape the Spectre comes off as gross exaggeration on your part. Totally ridiculous.

John has done so in two occasions citizenbane has even posted scans/. @Killemall said: @Switchdoctor said: Thats not TP, when you say TP its like being able to put down a character using telepathy, not the same thing.? Soooo, Superman used a S.T.A.R.

Labs psi-blocker to do what then? If you say something in the battle forum people expect you to back it by using scans or issue number. Um, you didn't ask for proof, you just expected me to spoonfeed you the issue numbers when it's all over the internet.

If you don't believe what I'm saying, then meh. And being able to reprogram Doomsday isnt Telepathy. Clearly you haven't read anything about.

If you prefer, Black 'reprogrammed' Doomsday so that his hatred for Superman was redirected towards Imperiex probes. In any case, that outclasses what J'onn is able to do with his psionics. John has done so in two occasions citizenbane has even posted scans/ The only way that J'onn could possibly do anything to the Spectre is to mindscrew with the host's mind. It's sort of the same thing as Psylocke being able to affect Ghost Rider by getting to Dan Ketch.

In the end, a feat like that wouldn't make J'onn better than Psycho, Black, Maxima, or Brainiac. And no, no way in hell is J'onn doing anything directly to Aztar. @Switchdoctor said: The only way that J'onn could possibly do anything to the Spectre is to mindscrew with the host's mind. It's sort of the same thing as Psylocke being able to affect Ghost Rider by getting to Dan Ketch.

In the end, a feat like that wouldn't make J'onn better than Psycho, Black, Maxima, or Brainiac. And no, no way in hell is J'onn doing anything directly to Aztar. He pulled the Spectre onto the astral plane in JLA #35 and then made contact with his unconscious mind in Soul War. The only person who has ever screwed with the host's mind was Parallax in Rebirth. I am not sure why you think Aztar is some impenetrable fortress, if anything without a host he is more susceptible to manipulation, which is what Eclipso did to him in Day of Vengeance. J'onn has read the minds of everyone on Earth several times, none of the people you mentioned have ever done anything resembling that as far as I know. @Switchdoctor said:?

Soooo, Superman used a S.T.A.R. Labs psi-blocker to do what then?

To given Doomsday back the control over his powers, Braniac being able to supress Doomsday personality after having taken control over his body through techonology means is not really telepathy. Um, you didn't ask for proof, you just expected me to spoonfeed you the issue numbers when it's all over the internet. If you don't believe what I'm saying, then meh. I asked which issue it happened 3 post before. And what are you talking about all i asked was which issue it was so i can go check it out myself. Clearly you haven't read anything about.

If you prefer, Black 'reprogrammed' Doomsday so that his hatred for Superman was redirected towards Imperiex probes. In any case, that outclasses what J'onn is able to do with his psionics. I expressly said the first time you brought up this that i havent read ANYTHING on Manchester Black, coz i simply havent. Being reprogrammed using technology isnt still a telepathy that people use in battle though. The only way that J'onn could possibly do anything to the Spectre is to mindscrew with the host's mind.

It's sort of the same thing as Psylocke being able to affect Ghost Rider by getting to Dan Ketch. In the end, a feat like that wouldn't make J'onn better than Psycho, Black, Maxima, or Brainiac. And no, no way in hell is J'onn doing anything directly to Aztar. Of course, but thats still a pretty damn good feat given the fact that Hal Jordan as Spectre was able to erase flash from everyone's memory on earth, that still put him above a normal planetary telepath, which is where Dr.

Brainiac isnt technically a telepath he just uses PSI blast from the technology and doesnt have much feats to show in that regard. Pyscho is a planet level telepath hasnt done anything to put him above that, Maxima is not even a planet level telepath why would she be above John anyways.

@CitizenBane said: @Switchdoctor said: He pulled the Spectre onto the astral plane in JLA #35 Not exactly. He thrusted himself into Hal Jordan's mind, and the rest of the JLA.

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He wanted to show Hal (who was ridden with guilt and cynicism for becoming Parallax) that even inside the Joker, the most warped of souls, that there is hope for redemption. He didn't thrust himself into the Spirit of Vengeance that is tethered to Hal. And then made contact with his unconscious mind in Soul War. Umm, it's waaaay more convoluted than that. There's a race called the Trans in that story that is trying to destroy the Earth. Later, we see them possessing 6 psychics who they find rather tasty.

Later still, the league discovers that the Trans in fact aren't an invading horde of aliens. They're psychic manifestations that feed off the fear and superstitions of the human race. The scene you're talking about when J'onn touches Hal's head, that's J'onn going for a mind-link only to unleash a voracious psychic shadow monster that was hiding inside Hal's mind.

The nightmare creature is so hungry that it attaches its tentacles to the members of the JLA, and begins touching them inappropriately on the deepest levels of their psyches. Batman yells at J'onn to break the mind link, but he can't.

All he did was wake up whatever was lurking inside Hal's head. It took J'onn and Aquaman giving his own telepathic push to sever the psionic link to Hal's consciousness. I am not sure why you think Aztar is some impenetrable fortress, if anything without a host he is more susceptible to manipulation, which is what Eclipso did to him in Day of Vengeance.? Eclipso is leagues more powerful than J'onn, or any telepath for that matter. There's no comparison. Eclipso is Aztar's predecessor who went from being the Spirit of Vengence, to becoming the Vengeance Demon. J'onn has read the minds of everyone on Earth several times, none of the people you mentioned have ever done anything resembling that as far as I know.

J'onn may have done the global mind read, but has he ever mind-controlled someone as resistant to telepathy as Doomsday? Has he ever done something like make Superman's and Bizarro's psychic consciousnesses swap bodies with his telepathy?

And Superman humiliated Manchester Black in Action Comics #775, it took him about a second to modify Black's brain to delete his telepathy. Black actually started weeping. And this helps J'onn's case.how? I have no idea where you're going with this one. Total red herring.

@Killemall said: @Switchdoctor said:? Soooo, Superman used a S.T.A.R.

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Labs psi-blocker to do what then? To given Doomsday back the control over his powers, Braniac being able to supress Doomsday personality after having taken control over his body through techonology means is not really telepathy. Whatever you say. Lowball the feat all you want, but it's still telepathy.

Not that it matters though, because Brainiac has done better by being the only guy that has mind-controlled Lobo. And before you try and lowball that feat, go through your comics and learn to appreciate just how difficult that is. I expressly said the first time you brought up this that i havent read ANYTHING on Manchester Black, coz i simply havent. Being reprogrammed using technology isnt still a telepathy that people use in battle though. You're not getting it. Manchester Black is a telepath.

He mind-wiped Doomsday's brain so that whenever he saw an Imperiex probe, he had the urge to project all his hatred for Superman into smashing probes. As for your comment about Maxima being a 'planet level telepath', what does it matter if she is or isn't? She has defeated Brainwave, a 'planet level telepath', lobotomized Brainiac, and has mind zapped Orion unconscious inside a few panels. Last time I checked, Martians can't even read the mind of a New God.